I am a bit tired...

[Lildarwen]

Sorry to come up with this topic... but the last days have been a pain for me.

In fact I start to feel sick to log into LotRO. Why? The reason is very simple and complicated all together.

As I joined this game I did it mostly to meet old friends I have missed dearly. And because I wanted to roleplay again - to be in a serious roleplay environment that I have missed in WoW or EQ2. All the things that have been told to me, gave me hope that LotRO would be a milestone in roleplaying since MMORPGs exist.

In fact - it is not. Even it is not as bad as WoW with it's countless kiddies, who think RP is the abbreviation for 'Roxxor Powah'-Server. There is much more roleplay than I have ever seen before - but it's still a simple hack'n slay and item hunt - good old Everquest-style.

But there would be still the friends... and there it starts to become complicated.

To make a small reminiscence to Bilbo: I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve. That may sound bitter and yes I am bitter.

I really had great hopes as I joined the Thorns - I finally hoped to find a roleplay community, good friends, a good time and a lot of fun.

I did not find it. Most times I am running around alone and the only contact is the kinship channel. Even those friends I have come for initially are most times busy with their own stuff.

The few times we started something, it has been never finished. Even it was said that we want to do more stuff together - we have not.

The Great Barrow for example - it was on my question that several people wanted to do it. It was never finished. Even we agreed on a fixed time - it has not been done due to one or two were missing or simply did not show up - it was delayed - and delayed - and forgotten.

Garth Agarwen the same - I begged to do it - we waited for quite some time till some people finally showed up - and then I had to leave due to RL business. It was never continued and my (ok I have to admit) weak questions have never been answered.

Dol Dinen is the same. After the first evening was never continued I tried to do it with some PUG and failed terrible.

Fact is that I have not much time to play. And when I play I want fun. The last weeks had some good days - but it was not enough for me.

In fact: the roleplay is only occassionally - it seems to me some of you are tired of the game already and looking for a new one. It looks like I have joined an already dieing community (in LotRO of course). Maybe I am wrong and just hit a bad time.

Simple said: I feel closed out - I feel alone - and I don't like to play much with random people.

What I will do now I don't know. Right now I feel tired and exhausted (also due to the immense work I have to do in RL). The Thorns give me nothing at the moment except a feeling of being left alone.

You all are great people and if I would have met you earlier then maybe I would see it different. But it is how it is...

I am sorry.

Yours
Lil

[Sayvara]

Hey Lil.

I understand what you feel, really I do. And you also had the bad luck of coming during the summer slump. In the summer, many people go on vacation or chose to soak up the sun while it is here. And also several of the players - like for instance me - have had quite a workload, kind of like yourself.

What you chose is up to you, of course. If you want to leave, we will miss you. But if you are not happy, we cannot force you to stay.

It would be nice though if you gave pointers as to what it is you would like to see more of. A sort of wishlist. Suggestions for improvement are always welcome.

*hugs*

/S

[Archibold]

I hear you Lil , and i completely agree with every point.

I myself feel like this often.

I even roleplay hobbit that is IC very distanced from human and elven societies. Which alienates me even in RP.

And as for questing. We did quest together sometimes. But it was long ago.... I even have the whole epic quest lined up for doing - because i want to do it with the guild ... but i am still waiting

All this is bad. And i am glad you brought this up. I think we should make a guild meeting and discuss this problem.


But , on the other hand. For me positives outweight the negative.

Thorn is a group of great people who all share same interest for roleplaying , all pen and paper players, all mature , all friendly , all involved in community , all creative

All in all - this is one awsum guild - and i am not planing leaving it ( lest i get kicked out )

[Adjanah]

[edit] Upon review, this post is for all of us really, not just for Lilly. ^^

I can follow you Lilly, and I am glad you bring it up. And I can assure you that this is the state of things for most all of us these days. As Sayv says, we are in the middle of the summer slump. A lot of of us are working hard or are on vacation, and I for one do not always have the energy to devote myself as fully to the rp as I intend to. I am sure many of you can testify to that as well.

However, and this is a very very important point that we *all* have to understand: Things do not happen by themselves. If you want to go to Garth Agarwen, Dol Dinen, most anything that takes up a full group, you cannot always expect to find it by just logging on. We are a small guild, nay, a *tiny* guild, and getting a full group is tough at best without PRIOR PLANNING. What I am saying is that it is EVERY MEMBER'S responsibility to take an active part in what we have here. Want to go to Dol Dinen? Post it on the forum and make it known a few days prior. The guild is not here to provide everything for you. Occasionally you need to take up the towel yourself and set something off.

This goes for both quest-grouping and events.

Someone smart once said "the squeaky wheel gets the grease", and this is very much true for us as well. If you're not heard, it means you're getting drowned out and need to shout louder. Haelewulf is a shining example to us all when it comes to helping out the squeaky wheels, and I myself strive to be as helpful as that.

Bottomline is: You are as lonely as you permit yourself to be. It's YOUR responsibility as much as anyone elses to make sure you are *part* of the group. We're joined here by our love for roleplay, we are not here to provide everything to you. When I feel lonely, all it takes is a peek at the kinship listing to see where people are, and a /tell to ask for grouping, RP, whatever. I know a lot of people have trouble reaching out and poking people into action, but that is what it takes in a game like this. That's when you have to remember that we're all nice people here. None of us are going to bite if you ask for company.

I know I've experienced you to be an awesome rp'er lately, not to mention a lovely person, so I would not turn you down unless I was in the middle of something else I could not just abandon. And I am sure this goes for the whole guild. Reach out. We're there to grab you. ^^

[Sayvara]

Reach out. We're there to grab you. ^^

Mmm... we sure are. *grins and licks her lips* HURGH!!! *gets yanked hard by the leash* Bah... my silly player says I'm not to grab sweet elven girls without permission. Friggin' spoilsport... *mutters angrilly*

/S

[Lildarwen]

I know that part of the problem lies within myself.

I am most times very closed and just keep my mouth shut instead of asking. Because I am afraid to disturb others. And most of my questions come out to be very 'weak' or are not good to see as a plea (like 'thought we wanted to finish the Great Burrow').

When I act like this and I am getting no or - even worse - a wrong reply ('look for a group') then I crawl inside my nutshell - swallow a tear - and log off or run around alone Because - and I am sorry to say so - I am not an idiot - I know I can look for groups - but then I do not ask those I see as friends in my kinship.

But that's me - Kellidir and Candil know that I am a wuss and sometimes very sensitive.

And it's not about me leaving the Thorns - but it may be you shall not see me for quite some time. Because I have waited too long - and now it hurts and I have tears in my eyes.

Yours
Lil

[Adjanah]

Lilly! Honey! For god's sake! Please, now we know there's a problem and we can do something about it! I know I'm brash and I'm loudmouthed and I'm ever so sorry if I've managed to tread on you as well. Heaven knows it wouldn't be the first time that I hadn't noticed. And I know it's not just about me, but still...I'm prepared to do my part.

Please, can't we settle it with hugs and togetherness instead of you keeping even more to yourself?

[Haelewulf]

As someone who also has a tendency to run roughshod over people, often without realizing the full depths of the hurt I'm causing (more so recently than ever before), I'm sorry as well for any part I had in this.
I hear what you're saying, and it's not enough that we just identify the problem, but that we also actively work to change it. Having said that, it seems that recently there have been a couple of situations where people are feeling hurt or sidelined and don't want to bring it up for fear of rocking the boat.
I'd like to think that we're getting close enough to be able to deal with these things openly and frankly, before they get chance to become a big and divisive issue.
I'm glad to hear you're not planning to leave the Thorn, Lil, and I hope I can entice you back in the very near future with my next offer!
This week I'm redecorating, so I don't know how much I'll be able to be on... but for the remainder of this week, I am at the disposal of the Thorn. Just let me know what you need doing, and we can try and coordinate something. I'll be on basically every night, as far as I know... although as I say, that could change. So let me know a good time for you to do a run, be it Great Barrows, Garth Agarwen, or Dol Dinen, and if I'm online, I'll be there. In fact I'll go ahead and start a new thread to that effect.
And thanks for the acknowledgement, Adjanah. I do my best, and it's a pleasure to help when people are so appreciative!
You're a lovely group of people, and I've thoroughly enjoyed getting to know you all as best I can. I'm sure we can get through this rough spot, and be all the closer for it.
With warm regards,
Wulfy.

[Archibold]

I think there is some reason to blame LOTRO itself.
LOTRO is a game focused on quests , not grinding. Yay! Enough boring grind , we all say ...
But....that would be fine and swell , if almost 99% of the quest is not bound to prerequisite quests.

Lil here gives example of Dol Dinen quests. I spend entire week in various PUG's to do few of those quests. And each of those quests is at least 1 hour long.

Now due to nature of prerequisite quest structure. I can not share quests i have with Lil , neither do i gain any benefit of doing this very dangerous and long lasting quests again. So helping anyone with this - becomes a chore. And when you have only 2 hours of gameplay time 4 days a week. Doing chores is not fun at all.

LOTRO is steadily evolving, and i am sure devs will recognise this problem very soon , and fix it.
But right now , i think this is the part of reason why friends and guildmates tend to group together less and less often...

[Beodric]

WHO is up for dol dinen ?!?

me me me me me me

now for the post itself , like arch i agree with you lil on almost every point ,i have felt like you more then once and was actully largly upset only recently, luckly for me i might say i found it useful it keep a few friends that are not guildies that i could do things with and talk icly and oocly ( specialy one praticular person).
now aye, i have gotten a few times help , specialy form the great hugy father wulf but also from lira and some more, and also planed to do somequesting with janah for about 3 times that I had to cancel for one reason or the other, but it remains somewhat facty that there is some feeling of being alone and little out of the loop, now usualy it is not severe( as it was once or twice till now) but well things are left alone, pepole dosent notice others and there requests at times and dont think can blame summer and work for that .

but lil and any other , i will say this honestly at least for me, if you are in need of help, just rp or whatever dont hesitate to ask , a lot of times i am in need of that myself or lonly and i just...dont have it to disturb others that seem happy with what they are doing, and i wouldnt want any other to feel the same about it, specialy with me.

[Adjanah]

As I also told you when we talked, Beo, the responsibility is also yours if you feel alone. Each and every one of us have to actively seek company. I can say this plainly: In a guild like this, it is not enough to just wait till people invite you into the fun. You have to show that you are interested and that you are even willing to devote time to it. And most of all you have to let us know.

This is the internet. It can be damn hard gauging whether or not people are feeling lonely when they do not say so. We have no way of seeing what kind of mood you're in. So I implore you on my crying knees, to those that say that they feel lonely: SAY so. Let us know. And if you are not heard the first time, try again. As I've mentioned earlier, none of us here have any responsibility to provide anyone else with fun. IF someone does, it is of their own free will, and gods bless them for that. But basically, you are on your own. You HAVE to actively SEEK the action. This guild is not just a place to hang out and, well, hang on for the ride. We expect you to take part.

Sending a guildmember a /tell asking for company or help is NOT a bad thing. It is expected of you to do that. The worst thing that can happen is that you get a "now is not a good time, I'm rather busy". Please folks...don't hold back, I beg you.